What Do Women Want?
Posted by: Guy LeCharles Gonzalez on May 18, 2007 at 5:14 pm
On the heels of a contentious week or so of debate over whether or not superhero comics are for girls, Johanna Draper Carlson attempts to shift the tone of the discussion, pointing out a post by Comic Fodder’s “Ryan”, who asks the age old question: “What Do Women Want in Superhero Comics?
(Assuming that things like Power Girl’s breasts as depicted by Michael Turner are an obvious problem, and that the publishers don’t plan to repeat the infamous scenes from Identity Crisis…)
WHAT DO WOMEN WANT IN SUPERHERO COMICS ? What would draw you in? What would have to happen in Superman, Batman, Wolverine, Wonder Woman, Ms. Marvel or any of the cape and tights comics to make you consider giving those comics a second glance? What sort of stories would interest you? How could the characters be handled in a manner which doesn’t make you simply roll your eyes?
What’s working for you now? What can you cite as an example? What can the publishers do more of?
Or is that not a good question?
One could argue that it’s not a good question simply because “women” — like “the black vote” and “teenage girls” — are not some monolothic entity that can be categorized and bullet-pointed into a ready-to-serve demographic. For every Hilary Clinton, there’s an Anne Coulter and Nancy Pelosi on either side of her, with a Barbara Bush and Audre Lorde on either side of them. Want to pick the perfect comic book for that quintet?
(I’d give them Bumperboy, personally, because everybody loves Bumperboy! Except maybe Coulter. She’s evil. Dammit!)
My wife, an avid book reader, loved Batman Begins, The Incredibles and Unbreakable, and has enjoyed a variety of hand-selected comics — including Persepolis, Bumperboy and Fade From Grace — but wouldn’t touch a traditional superhero comic with a 10-foot pole, as much because of the art as the genre itself. Same goes for manga, BTW, doubly so. She loved 300 the movie, but wasn’t thrilled with the graphic novel (which she read first), partly because of the art, and partly because she preferred Steven Pressfield’s far superior historical fiction, Gates of Fire: An Epic Novel of the Battle of Thermopylae.
Comics, never mind superhero comics, simply aren’t her thing. And she’s a very visual person, much moreso than I am, so please don’t offer that tired line.
The reality is that it’s not so much that WOMEN don’t find superhero comics worth reading, it’s that MOST PEOPLE don’t find superhero comics worth reading. Looking at the amount of low-rated dreck that’s aired on Lifetime, Spike, BET, MTV, et al, I’d say specifically targeting women (or any other demographic) is the wrong way to go for superhero comics, at least in the context of this discussion.
Whether for man, woman or child, I’d say that telling engaging stories from a variety of viewpoints is the all-important first step.
There are, to be frank, simply too many white boys who grew up reading superhero comics writing them today, and as a result, there’s a certain cultural and social myopia that pervades the core Marvel and DC universes, limiting their appeal to a broader audience. Not because the characters wear improbable costumes while punching each other in the face — when they’re not sitting around talking and crying over the state of affairs in their respective worlds, that is — but because they’re a bunch of powerful white men with a smattering of token others, and there’s more than enough of that in the real world; who wants to see it in their escapist entertainment?
After diversifying their roster of creators, the next step would be “casting” their stories with a diverse group of characters; diverse not just in gender, but in race, sexuality, politics and — perhaps the most overlooked aspect — diverse in personality. Too many comic book superheroes are interchangeable, sharing a handful of motivations and personality quirks. It is arguably the primary reason Marvel typically outsells DC, because they have more characters who are relatable to a wider range of people than DC’s predominantly white male, god-like icons. And, to be honest, they have a slightly more diverse group of creators.
So, what do women want in superhero comics?
Hell if I know, since I’m not a woman, but if I were, I certainly wouldn’t deign to speak for them all. Generally speaking, though, I’d hazard a guess that it’s the same thing anybody else wants: a good story, well-told and illustrated, that engages their imagination while not insulting their intelligence. If I were publisher attempting to expand my audience beyond the current micro-niche that reads superhero comics, that’d be my game plan.
Erech Overaker May 18th, 2007
“One could argue that it’s not a good question simply because “women” — like “the black vote” and “teenage girls” — are not some monolothic entity that can be categorized and bullet-pointed into a ready-to-serve demographic”
LIES. They all server under the uni-gina-mind, goals include – learning to please their man (see also “standing by him”), decoupage, and “naggery as a sport”.
:)
Actually, spun from that statue debate, and the recent article in Bitch about women in comics, I’m not really sure ALL the women who are calling comics on their insane fetish/sexism towards women WOULD buy comics under most circumstances. Just because I think (well, know) porn does the same thing, and call them on it, doesn’t mean I’d start buying any of it if they toned it down, ya know?
I see people trying to spin the debate from “yeah it’s sexist and creepy BUT there are some good comics out there that you should try”, when instead everything before the BUT should be addressed by the people in the industry.
But we won’t. Nerds love our whore statues. The whole Bugs Bunny in a dress thing…
Ryan May 19th, 2007
I’m currently begging forgiveness for how the question was phrased. I am not asking men what they think women want, which is sort of SOP for this question. The question was written as a response to numbers presented by two sources that suggested that 90% of superhero comic readers were men, but that number did not appear to be reflective of other genres of comics.
I’m hoping to poll female readers of comics what would make them not roll their eyes at superhero comics. Unfortunately, it was too little, too late before I realized my question could be read in a “mass minority” context, and I apologize.
I hope female comic readers (and non comic readers alike) feel welcome to respond at Comic Fodder.
Katherine Dacey-Tsuei May 19th, 2007
One of the biggest barriers to entry with the tights-and-capes stuff is the complicated mythology that surrounds older characters. As Dirk Deppey has pointed out, one of the reasons that Naruto sells well is that there’s a pretty close correspondence between the original comic and subsequent anime adaptations. The same is seldom true for the most popular superhero comics, however. Where on earth would I begin if I wanted to learn more about the characters in Spiderman? It certainly wouldn’t be obvious to a casual browser, whereas I can buy volume one of, say, Crying Freeman or Bleach and know that I’m actually reading the very first installment of the series.
This isn’t just a problem for female readers, of course, but I think it’s one of the reasons that I don’t invest much in mainstream DC/Marvel superhero titles.
ACBG May 20th, 2007
This is going to sound like a beauty pagent answer but its the only way I could express it.
I want female charaters to be written in the same standard as their male counterparts. I want more female charaters in comic books. I want more female charaters with their own titles. I would like a female character in every comic book but that’s in an ideal society.
Guy LeCharles Gonzalez May 21st, 2007
@Erech: Which issue of Bitch is that? Have to check it out.
@Ryan: Every genre has its core readership, while also having a range of peripheral fans. The reality is, with Marvel and DC, female readers are on the periphery and as such, have little of the necessary economic clout to effect any significant change in their books. Looks like you’re getting some solid responses on your post, so it’s all good.
@Katherine: That’s definitely an issue with Marvel/DC superheroes, even for a fan like me; triply so for a newbie coming in through the movies or cartoons. Interestingly, I’ve found the overwhelming number of volumes available for some of the more popular manga series to be off-putting, though my following Fables in TPBs has helped to change my perception of that a bit.
@ACBG: If pageanty means clear and right-to-the-point, then yeah. ;-)
Erech Overaker May 21st, 2007
Guy, it’s the latest issue, came out last month. The mag is bi-monthly or so, so you should be able to find it on the racks still.
Erech Overaker May 21st, 2007
I actually have 2 copies of it, if you email me a mailing address I’ll give you one.
I really like bitches, it seems.
Katherine Dacey-Tsuei May 21st, 2007
Those mega-series can be daunting for the committed manga fan, too! Maybe in my next life I’ll try reading all 35 volumes of Ranma 1/2.
There are a number of one-short and short series that I’d highly recommend to someone looking to branch out from American comics (indie or mainstream). Planetes, for example, is a great five-volume series that’s free of schoolgirls in sailor suits and sword-wielding teenage boys. It’s an intelligent sci-fi series that explores social, political, and philosophical questions without being pretentious. I could see it appealing to a fan of BSG, as it also boasts a cast full of smart, capable female characters.
